Nigeria needs common sense people like you. The way you analyze issues and cut through the clutter, is impressive.
I do agree that if more Afro-Americans would acquire higher education, the level of racism in America would drop. And as soon as the status of blacks in America is elevated, it would inadvertently trickle down to blacks on other continents.
Statistics: Posted by fw12 — Fri Aug 24, 2007 9:06 pm
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This idea of hard work applies more to African-Americans, than it does to Africans. For most poor Africans, it doesn't matter how hard they work, the opportunity for advancement just isn't there, or the government is corrupt as hell.
Let me emphasize that working really hard may not necessarily produce immediate results for you personally. But if we maintain a tradition of hard work, it would make a big difference several generations down the line.
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I realize a number of African immigrants look down on African Americans because African American culture doesn't emphasize education as much as African, Arab or Asian cultures.
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Justifiably so. Blacks from Africa come to America and go on to become highly educated. Most of them lack these opportunities at home, and so know the value of it. Afro-Americans don't seem to appreciate education. If you speak English a little too well, you're dubbed an uncle Tom. Why?
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But no one ever stops to consider the roots of this culture are rooted deep in slave culture and structural racism. Why do so many people expect such a drastic change from a Civil Rights Era that lasted little more than ten years? It's been 40 years and racism still exists.
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Currently, Afro-Americans don't have a leader. Al Sharpton, Jesse Jackson, etc need to begin changing minds. Higher education would conquer racism in the long run. We need more Afro-Americans to be lawyers. If you know your rights, nobody would dare mess with you. Furthermore, most members of parliament/politicians are lawyers. It's almost a credential that gets you in these days.
The more blacks in leadership positions that America has, the less significant racism becomes.
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Yes, Harvard and many other preppy colleges accept black people at a higher rate than white people, but everyone forgets than before college comes high school, middle school, intermediate school etc., Looking at the socioeconomic conditions, something definitely went wrong in precollege education. I'm not going to go into detail but there is some problem that is hindering blacks from going up higher in the social ladder, an event that would consequently expand their geographical curiosity.
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I agree with you. All the good schools are located in the good neighborhoods. Since very few blacks live in the good neighborhoods, black kids cannot attend the good schools. It's almost like institutionalized segregation. Roza Parks single-handedly fought whites and won. Blacks of today need to start fighting for better schools in their neighborhoods.
Statistics: Posted by Richard Akindele — Wed Aug 22, 2007 6:39 pm
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Although it seems logical to you that working harder will get me twice as close to my goals, I really don't believe it will get me any closer to my aspirations than if I had worked normally. But again, since it's a matter that has high implications, I feel it would be an interesting experiment to attempt.
Statistics: Posted by fairykarma — Tue Aug 21, 2007 9:40 pm
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Yes, if you're an underdog, you have to work harder than the average guy if you want to get to the top. Why is that so hard to comprehend?
Get with the program. I'm trying to tell you something, but you keep coming up with every excuse in the book to dispel my facts. You should be on my corner on this.
I've been down this road many times before. The story never changes. Blacks always come up with excuses as to why they can't succeed, and that excuse is always, discrimination. Even after I've proven conclusively that they're wrong.
Read Reallionaire by Farrah Gray. Let's continue this discussion once you've done that.
Statistics: Posted by Richard Akindele — Tue Aug 21, 2007 6:23 pm
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I mean I don't see many white people hard at work accomplishing their goals. I don't see many white people overachieving. I've been in classes with white people; I've worked with them. A lot of them aren't exactly creative entrepreneurs. You seem to have expectations for black people that are too high even for Whites, Asians, and Hispanics.
I'm sure there is a small percentage of blacks doing something about their poverty. Like 10%. But don't expect a miracle from all black people. We're only human.
Statistics: Posted by fairykarma — Tue Aug 21, 2007 5:40 pm
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Is that right?
If that's what you're saying, then I respecfully disagree.
Of all the wealthy blacks America has to offer, when was the last time a well-to-do black person flew around the world in a baloon? Success in this world is not about how much money you have in the bank, but how much you're determined to have in the bank.
Consider this scenario. A "poor" Afro-American black wonders what it entails to be an importer/exporter. He finds out he needs ~$15,000 to get started. That's a lot of money. But, it's possible if he puts his mind to it.
For one year, he holds down two jobs, working 18 hours a day. At the end of the year, he already has that much saved up. Now he's set to take the dive into the business of his dreams. So, in just one year, he's changed the course of his life.
Tell me what is wrong with that scenario.
You and I know that a typical Afro-American won't do that, even though it's possible. Tell me why.
The reason is that, for whatever reason, blacks are inherently not curious people. It has little to do with wealth. An Afro-American would rather convince himself that the "white man" is against him, rather than to actually work twice as hard as the next guy to succeed.
Thank you for helping me underscore my point that whites are generally more curious than blacks. If you don't venture, you don't gain.
There are so many opportunities in the world. You've got to go get them. They won't come to you.
There's something I agree with you on, and that is the fact that blacks have fewer opportunities in the world, due mainly to discrimination. Blacks are discriminated against in many settings. But all that notwithstanding, it's no reason to not keep trying. When you fall flat on your back, you pick yourself up, dust yourself off, and try again.
There are so many things Afro-Americans could be doing. E.g. collect used computers/books/clothes/automobiles, etc. and export them to Africa. Why won't they do that? One could setup a nonprofit organisation and use it to raise money for such ventures. Generally, only whites engage in such ventures. Why is that? A lack of curiosity or course.
My long term vision is that, if today's blacks refuse to accept defeat, but keep striving against all odds, eventually, blacks would be in such high places in the world, that discrimination becomes very minimal. After all, if blacks are the ones pulling the strings, it means there's nobody to discriminate against blacks. My vision can become reality in just a few generations. Unfortunately, as long as blacks keep making excuses, that won't happen anytime soon.
Statistics: Posted by Richard Akindele — Tue Aug 21, 2007 2:58 pm
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I'm not thinking so much emotionally as I am skeptically. I'm black myself and I know sure as hell I wouldn't want to spend any time in Antarctica at all for the obvious reason that it's below zero. I have seen many blogs of white people doing crazy things. Specifically, one blog of a white couple who traveled around the world in a motorcycle. Saved up, quit their job, and decided to do the damn thing. Another, a white guy who decided to throw away seven years of college in industrial design and engineering in order to move to Indonesia. The guy spent a couple years teaching himself photography and he is a professional photographer now. He also married an Indonesian lady and now has two kids. I have many other examples in your favor, but I feel the categories you have set to measure geographical curiosity are too narrow.
White men sail balloons around the world because they have money. Poor whites almost never fly balloons. I guarantee you most if not all the people in Antarctica have a damn good college education, something that seems to escape a lot of blacks due to economic disadvantage. The white people I mentioned above are all financially stable. The white guy and girlfriend who took the trip around the world were promised that their jobs would still be open when they got back. The white guy with the Indonesian wife makes much much more than the average Indonesian.
Now on to black people.
I guess I'll start with myself. I'm a black guy living the U.S right now in boring white suburbia. Looking at my bookshelf right now, I'll list out some books I have
Archeology of Knowledge by Michel Foucault
Patton: A Genius For War by Carlo D'Este
A Treatise of Human Nature by David Hume
The Critique of Pure Reason by Immanuel Kant
A Thousand Plateaus by Gilles Deleuze
Confessions of a Mask by Yukio Mishima
Norwegian Wood by Haruki Murakami
Ake by Wole Sonyinka
Against the Day Thomas Pynchon
I currently have a collection of about 500 books mainly philosophical, classic, modernist, and postmodernist literature. Percentage of black people like me? Well below 1%. The main difference? It can't be money. Books are pretty cheap on half.com. What are my goals? I plan on working here for ten-fifteen years. Invest, blah blah, move to rural China and become a philanthropist in education and health care. Now would you know I was black if I hadn't told you? I'm using myself as an example because I don't fit with the typical conception of a black person at all.
African Americans make up 13% of the the U.S. population. Let's take a look at what Wikipedia says.
[quote]
Economically, blacks have benefited from the advances made during the Civil Rights era. The racial disparity in poverty rates has narrowed. The black middle class has grown substantially. In 2000, 47% of African Americans owned their homes. The poverty rate among African Americans has dropped from 26.5% in 1998 to 24.7% in 2004.[13]
However, African Americans are still underrepresented in government and employment. In 1999, the median income of African American families was $33,255 compared to $53,356 of Whites. In times of economic hardship for the nation, African-Americans suffer disproportionately from job loss and underemployment, with the black underclass being hardest hit. The phrase "last hired and first fired" is reflected in the Bureau of Labor Statistics unemployment figures. Nationwide, the September 2004 unemployment rate for blacks was 10.3%, while their white counterparts were unemployed at the rate of 4.7%.
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Sound particularly optimistic? No. If African Americans are earning significantly less than whites, do you expect them to do all those fancy things you mentioned? Let alone have the money to fly to China and start a business. I realize a number of African immigrants look down on African Americans because African American culture doesn't emphasize education as much as African, Arab or Asian cultures. But no one ever stops to consider the roots of this culture are rooted deep in slave culture and structural racism. Why do so many people expect such a drastic change from a Civil Rights Era that lasted little more than ten years? It's been 40 years and racism still exists. Yes, Harvard and many other preppy colleges accept black people at a higher rate than white people, but everyone forgets than before college comes high school, middle school, intermediate school etc., Looking at the socioeconomic conditions, something definitely went wrong in precollege education. I'm not going to go into detail but there is some problem that is hindering blacks from going up higher in the social ladder, an event that would consequently expand their geographical curiosity.
So my conclusion is blacks are only as geographically curious as their bank account.
Yes, there are black people in Asia, but due to financial constraints on the race, not many exist. Also due to financial constraints, poverty is most likely what they experience like in Vietnam:
http://www.thanhniennews.com/features/? ... wsid=25510
This is an article about the way many black people live in Vietnam.
The black immigrants in Europe don't have it any easier. Ayaan Hirsi Ali is far from the norm.
In response to your questions, yes white people are more likely to do all those things but it's because they have more money and they've had the money for so damn long (centuries) they started coming up with new ways to spend it. Motorcycling around the world is one of them. Not many Asians, mestizos, or blacks travel around the world in motorcycles. This is strictly a money issue not a race issue.
A lower socioeconomic status lowers your ability to accomplish those things. It's unfair to blame black people for their lower socioeconomic status. It's almost as inane as blaming someone for being alive.
So... I'm sure there are many blacks who would [i]want[/i] to motorcycle around the world. But they don't have the money to do so.
Statistics: Posted by fairykarma — Tue Aug 21, 2007 2:24 am
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You mentioned a few great white people, then said the rest are forgettable. Do you really believe that? I don't. You may succeed in finding some whites that can't do certain things such as point out Iraq on the map. But in general, whites are more curious than blacks.
I have experience with a good number of subsections of whites as well as blacks to draw my samples from. In general, I'm justified in saying that whites are curious people, while blacks are more likely to maintain the status quo.
This has nothing to do with color of the skin as you wrongly qualified it in your reply. When I say white, I mean the white race. When I say black, I mean the black race. Shades of colors exists on either side enough to invalidate your argument. When you hear "black/white", think race, not skin color.
To keep things simple, let's give some perspective to my point of view...
Who is more likely to travel around the world on a motorcycle or in a balloon? Black or white? Why?
Who is more likely to spend the winter months (-89°C) in Antarctic? White or black? Why?
Who is more likely to travel to off the beaten path places of the world? Why?
If your answer to each of the above is "white" as opposed to "black", then you're invariably agreeing with my position that whites "generally" are more curious than blacks. And that is exactly the point I'm making.
I can rebut your points further. But I'll give you a chance to respond first without overly complicating issues for you.
When you respond, put your emotions aside, and think rationally. Most importantly, support your position with concrete examples as I've done above.
Statistics: Posted by Richard Akindele — Mon Aug 20, 2007 5:22 pm
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Blacks on the other hand, probably don't know much about China. Not many of their ancestors visited that part of the world. Consequently, most black migrations will be to the West. America and Europe, the fabled paved streets of gold and all that unnecessary crap.
As China's economy grows, you'll probably start seeing China become a melting pot.
If anything, you should've said Americans have little curiosity about the world they live in. Don't just group all Caucasians together. Most Americans apparently can't identify Iraq on a map. You'll be hard pressed to find many Americans who can identify the major powers in the middle East. Given this, you shouldn't expect them to know much about China. They can't tell apart Chinese, Korean, and Japanese people. All the languages are the same to them. All Asians are the same to them. Chinese is same as Asian to them. You'll probably give them a headache when you mention the word "han" or "hui" or "lao".
I don't admire your race mentality. You seem to have the mentality that the Caucasian race as a whole has accomplished great things. No they haven't. Einstein did great things. Rene Descartes did great things. Plato did great things. Winston Churchill did great things. and the many other white people out there that actually got up and decided to do something with their lives. Most Caucasians today and the in past are swimming in an ocean of mediocrity. Only a few have pulled society forward (or at least influenced it). The rest are deadbeats. I hate say the it, blacks suffer the same. Poverty or no poverty, the majority of people in a population are mediocre and live very uneventful lives. Doesn't matter what race you are.
You're really not going to get anywhere by blaming a whole race. It's all economics. If your race has more economic advantages and/or a bigger population, they are bound to have more intellectual achievements. But it's very very stupid to say Whites did this or Blacks did this. Not true. Individuals did that.
What most people forget is, at the end of the day, you're still human. We all die. So why spend your life playing these race games? A race doesn't accomplish anything as a whole. A small group of Individuals do all the work while everyone piggybacks on these accomplishments. It's really sad that the only difference that makes this such a divisive issue is skin color.
Statistics: Posted by fairykarma — Mon Aug 20, 2007 12:20 am
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I was surprised nigerians or blacks are [b]NOT[/b] in china.
Statistics: Posted by Richard Akindele — Wed Jul 25, 2007 4:47 am
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Statistics: Posted by sima — Tue Jul 24, 2007 9:56 pm
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Judging from the awe and intrigue registered on the faces of every Chinese person that saw me, I could tell that people in that city have had little or no contact with a black person in the past.
For seven days, I did not set eyes on a single black person. How can a city of 5.3 million people be so devoid of a particular race? Now and again, you bump into caucasians from all parts of the globe, but not blacks.
Is this an indication of why blacks aren't progressive?
Blacks have very little curiosity about the world they live in. Blacks are not known for exploring new frontiers. Blacks are masters at finger-pointing about how much of a raw deal they've gotten, usually from whites. However, I can see opportunities at our feet that we're not seizing.
The largest chunk of the blame goes to African-Americans. These people, who are incredibly racist anti-whites, are often willing to forgo their own advancement, just to prove that whites are indeed racist against them.
I was astonished at the low prices of goods and services in China. African-Americans have opportunities that the rest of the world doesn't. African-Americans often don't go to school, even though they can. They hardly take a leap of faith to become entrepreneurs, even though America offers such opportunities. When was the last time you saw a black American with his own store of goods ordered from China?
African and Carribean blacks are just as guilty. However, I'm willing to give them a little pass due to the poverty situation in Africa. African-American blacks however, don't get a pass. They are the reason the black race as a whole is a step behind.
Wake up Afro-Americans! Opportunities exist beyond your immediate vicinities. Explore them. As your standard of living improves in America, you'd gradually be in a position to bring other blacks around the globe onboard.
Statistics: Posted by Richard Akindele — Sun Jul 22, 2007 6:04 pm
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